Convert new HP 32bit Vista home premium to Vista 64bit Ultimate

I just bought a new HP a6350z AMD dual-core computer with 32bit Vista Home
Premium. I own a full retail license for Ultimate which is installed on an
older computer. I plan to remove it (or whatever's necessary to free the
license) so I can install the 64bit ultimate license on the new HP.

How disruptive is that? The new computer is almost unchanged from getting it
out of the box. I uninstalled Symantec AV and installed Windows OneCare for
which I already have a license. I installed the driver for my wireless HP
AIO c7820 which HP describes as being compatible with Vista 64. Not much
else is personalized and I haven't invested much time in it.

Am I basically starting from scratch? Or will existing programs that are
compatible simply work after the 64bit installation?

Thanks in advance for your time.

Chris Cowles
Gainesville, FL

You will need the 64bit versions of the drivers and you must do a custom
install, meaning you will have to reinstall your apps, files, and settings.
Make sure that the drivers and utilities cd from HP contains the x64
drivers. If not, download the x64 drivers and utilities from HP and burn
them to a cd.

There is no upgrade path from any x86 to any other x64 version of Windows so
you cannot perform an upgrade. You can use Windows Easy Transfer to save
the files and settings from and restore after x64 is installed. WET is both
x86 and x64 compatible. Have you asked HP about the warranty implications?

Having said all that, not all dual core processors are 64bit processors. If
you have a Core Duo you cannot run x64. If it is a Core 2 Duo you can. All
AMD64 cpus are 64bit processors.

> Have you asked HP about the warranty implications?

I have not but the system was available for purchase as either 32 or 64. I
doubt there's a difference except the OS and drivers.

> All AMD64 cpus are 64bit processors.

It's an AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual Core Processor 5600+ 2.8 GHz. That will do,
right?

I believe I will benefit from 64-bit and the dual-core CPU because I often
have multiple applications running concurrently. What I'm not looking
forward to is the time required for a full reinstall.

Is dual-boot installation a practical approach? Can I maintain the existing
32-bit home premium and install the 64-bit next to it, using the same
partition for data on both? I saw some vague references here to MSKBs but no
citations.

TIA

The problem with warranties is that HP support may demand that you return
the system to the factory configuration before they will address a software
support issue. You really need to ask them. Warranties are not done by
logic but by the written warranty terms and conditions. Ask.

Dual booting with Vista x86 and Vista x64 is fine since you have a separate
product key for x64. You will need to boot the computer with the x64 dvd
since you cannot run the x64 Setup from the x86 desktop. A Custom
installation takes only a few minutes. It is an upgrade that takes a lot of
time.

Each Vista will be able to see the other's drive and a common data drive is
also no problem.

The only issue you may have that I can think of is memory. If the HP only
has 2GB consider increasing it to 4GB for Vista Ultimate x64. When I ran on
2GB I had constant disk drive activity (paging). Now that I have a lot more
ram I can see that around 3GB is the sweet spot for VU x64. That is
actually a good thing because you want as much running in memory as you can
in order not to have to use the hard drive so much (hard drive access is
much slower than memory access). If you can't do the extra ram don't worry
too much about it, but anything less than 2GB simply is not enough for
Ultimate x64. In fact when you choose VU x64 in HP's configurator for a new
machine, a message displays that HP highly recommends 4GB for that option.
I agree with them.

I'm not worried about the software support issues. I'm probably better than
most techs I'll get on the phone and I didn't get the extended warranty.

I have 4 GB of RAM. Vista32 only sees 3.5 GB. I assume Vista64 will see all
4, less whatever's used by the video card, if any?

Programs: I'm under the impression that each application/package (e.g.,
Office) must be installed separately for each OS. Assuming so, do I end up
with duplication of files? Or, if I just let it install to the same
directory, it won't duplicate what already exists? Are there 64-bit versions
of programs that will overwrite 32-bit versions, disabling the 32-bit
version? (Or vice versa?)

Is there any advantage to having programs in a separate partition? Those
that came with the HP are already on C: and I can't reinstall some of them.
(The DVD viewer, for one.) The reason is the only copy I have is on the
recovery disk. I don't think I can reinstall it selectively. Since HP
already installed programs on C: for Vista32, I see no reason to change.

I'll may create a separate partition for data. I can resize the existing
partition and create a new one with the system management tools, I think.
What, if any, is the advantage of doing so? I've read somewhere that putting
the page file on a separate drive improves performance, but does that really
mean separate hard drives, vs separate partitions?

Thanks in advance for the help.

Chris Cowles
Gainesville, FL

> Programs: I'm under the impression that each application/package (e.g.,
> Office) must be installed separately for each OS. Assuming so, do I end up
> with duplication of files? Or, if I just let it install to the same
> directory, it won't duplicate what already exists? Are there 64-bit
> versions of programs that will overwrite 32-bit versions, disabling the
> 32-bit version? (Or vice versa?)

You will have separate program files for each install, but you can share the
data created between the systems so you don't have to manually keep in sync.
>
>
> I'll may create a separate partition for data. I can resize the existing
> partition and create a new one with the system management tools, I think.
> What, if any, is the advantage of doing so? I've read somewhere that
> putting the page file on a separate drive improves performance, but does
> that really mean separate hard drives, vs separate partitions?
>

You have somewhat limited ability to shrink partitions and create a new one
in Vista. You can help by getting rid of certain files before a defrag and
see if an otherwise unmovable file was at the end of the partition.
Separate drives can be used and occasionally benefit the pagefile placement,
but separate partitions on the same hd will degrade performance with your
heads thrashing due to the increased movement necessary to use the other
partition

Vista x64 will report all 4GB on the system properties page and when you
type "winver" in Start/Search. Vista x86 will report less than 4GB on both.
When SP1 is applied to Vista x86 it will start reporting 4GB on the system
properties page but continue to report less in winver.

You will install programs for each OS the same as if each OS were a
different computer. They will not be installed on a common Program Files
folder or on the same volume. If VHP x86 is on drive 1 all programs will
install in the Program Files folder on drive 1. If VU x64 is on drive 2,
32bit programs will install in the Program Files (x86) folder on drive 2 and
64bit programs will install in the Program Files folder on drive 2.

32bit programs run natively on 64bit processors so there is little need for
64bit versions of programs like Office.

You need to think of the two operating systems as separate computers. When
you install a program on VHP the installer writes many entries to VHP's
registry. VHP's registry cannot be used by VU. Likewise when you are
running VU and install a program the installer will write many entries to
VU's registry. Keep things simple and think of the two operating systems as
different computers. While you are running VHP don't worry about VU and
vice versa.

Do not try to play around with the page files now. While they could share a
common drive the days are past when you could gain much by manipulating the
page file. The page file manager is sophisticated and the hard drive
capacity in modern computers makes most of the reasons for playing around
with the page file pointless. Let the OS manage the page file. The answer
to heavy page file usage if you experience it is simply having ample memory.
Your 4GB is ample for VU x64. A ReadyBoost flash drive is also a very good
tool for handling page file usage.

You are trying to anticipate a lot of things that just won't matter. Just
set things up according to their defaults and use the system for awhile
before you start tweaking. You have to know what you have before trying to
customize.

Forget about the way things were done back in the days of Win95 and Win98.
Computers have changed radically with regards to resources. What we did to
improve performance on Win95 machines is counterproductive now. Hardware
and software vendors have incorporated features to address those old
concerns.

Learn how Vista works, don't try to turn Vista into something you got used
to years ago. Vista belongs to the NT branch of Windows and the NT branch
handles a lot of things differently from the DOS branch (Win9x/ME).

Well, this experiment succeeded in proving to me that I cannot upgrade
the computer I bought from VHP32 to VU64. I thought it could but
apparently it can't. At least the hardware I got can't, even though it
might be theoretically possible. When VU64 install completes, I
consistently get a BSOD on the second reboot. The page fault contains
nothing useful to me - just a memory address but no reference to
drivers, etc.

I called HP and they offered no help, of course. I didn't expect help
but hoped they would say definitively that the hardware (a6350z) would
or would not support 64-bit. I went back to the web page to simulate
buying it again and find that x64 is not an option. That's not
defiinitve that it's not possible with this mobo, but suggests so.

I've got an RMA on the box and ordered a different model. The new
m9100t with is sold with VHP64 at no extra cost above the 32bit
version. At least this way I know that 64bit works. Can I then do an
anytime upgrade from VHP64 to VU64, by entering my key? Assuming so, a
benefit of that approach is I get to keep the DVD stuff that comes
with VHP, that is absent from WU.

I discovered last night a reason I definitely want VU, not VHP. After
completing the VHP32 tweaking, I disconnected the mouse, keyboard and
monitor, set the new box in a corner with a USB wireless adapter
plugged in, and tried to RDP to it. No dice. VHP includes Remote
Assistance but not Remote Desktop.

A positive outcome of this is that the new box is actually cheaper
than the previous, and has a better video card and larger hard drive.
The AMD CPU was 2.8GHz and the new Intel is 2.3, but I don't know if
those numbers are directly related. I gave up 1 GB of RAM compared to
the earlier box but figure I can add RAM easily in the future.

I was going to ask questions about the drive 1/drive 2 discussion
below but, if I can use the anytime upgrade, it won't be a dual-boot
install.

Thanks to the assistance.
--
Chris Cowles
Gainesville, FL

Yes, you can use either Anytime Upgrade or buy a VU upgrade edition
(retail). The difference is that you can transfer the AU upgrade license to
another computer only once but you can transfer the VU upgrade edtion
license many times. Since the base VHP license is not transferrable to a
new machine at all (because it is an OEM license), the distinction may not
matter.

If you do AU be sure to order the optional dvd, especially if your new
computer does not come with a Vista hologrammed dvd.

I already have a full retail license for VU. I assume I can use that
for the upgrade? I could then transfer it to another, and also sell
the computer with the original VHP64 OEM. (That's unlikely though
because, like cars, I generally keep my computers past their useful
resale life.)

Does 4GB RAM make a dramatic difference vs 3GB? An increase to 4GB
adds $200 to the price because 3GB is a free upgrade from 2GB, but
also because it's a change from 667 MHz (3GB) to 800 MHz (4GB). The
3GB takes up 4 slots, so upgrade to 4GB later requires 2GB, by
removing out 2x512MB.
--
Chris Cowles
Gainesville, FL

Since the VHP is x64 you can start the VU setup from the VHP desktop and
just choose Upgrade Install. No problem. You do want to enter the product
key when given the opportunity but uncheck the activation box and give
yourself some extra time to evaluate how the upgrade went.

The sweet spot for VU x64 is 3GB. Save the bucks. I don't see much usage
above 2.5GB on my box and only then when I am running a virtual machine.
You should be fine with 3GB.

It also gets me 800MHz vs 667MHz but, as you say, I don't think the
incremental gains justify the incremental cost.

Now I'm waiting for delivery on another system.
--
Chris Cowles
Gainesville, FL